Housing Bubble, credit bubble, public planning, land use, zoning and transportation in the exurban environment. Specific criticism of smart growth, neotradtional, forms based, new urbanism and other top down planner schemes to increase urban extent and density. Ventura County, California specific examples.
Saturday, November 15, 2008
WTF Were They Thinking?
View Larger Map This is the neighborhood that is burning. The firefighters can't even triage in these conditions. High density stick housing surrounded on all three sides by fire terrain. Of course it was going to burn.
To a certain extent, this is Gifford Pinchot's fault - first in the West to state that mankind could conquer fire. So now there are generation's worth of fuel in those hills - which in an unmanaged state would have frequent mild fires.
Some of those newer neighborhods do pretty well in a wildfire. I am thinking of Foothill Ranch and Stevenson Ranch in particular. Often they are required to have sprinkler systems in the houses. That is the reason they can build them so close together. But I don't see the usual surrounding greenbelt in this picture.
During a trip across Europe one time I couldn't help but notice, seeing houses under construction in various places, that almost ALL homes there are built of brick, stone or cinder block. You rarely see the plywood mansions so ubiquitous in the states. When I see new homes going up here in the U.S. now they look even flimsier in my eyes than before. I can't believe we build like this, especially in areas prone to fire or hurricanes/tornadoes. Stone and brick may be more expensive in the beginning but I think it pays for itself in endurance.
What's the draw to California? Outside of those wanting to make it in show biz. You have high prices, low wages, high housing prices, fires every year, high deficit.
Bennie B. lit the fire to get rid of excess inventory. I would rather have it all burn down than see the deadbeats get cram-downs and rates below what solid citizens can get.
Shhhhh! California is a multi-generational experiment in the limits of cognitive dissonance. If the residents ever find out what's going on, they might wake up and want to come HERE.
By the way, having 300 days of sunny and dry weather isn't so impressive when you're on fire for 100 of those days.
I'm amazed by how fast things grow back here. I hear talk that burned areas will take years to return to normal. I'm used to things taking decades to grow back. Many decades. I suppose it would be the same here if some of the remaining evergreens burned.
Re stick-built houses, the thing is that they tend to do better in earthquakes. Unreinforced brick is pretty much a disaster waiting to happen in earthquake country, and it'll still burn if you ask nicely enough. Just look at all the 19th century brick towns that burned.
@ Akubi:
I've never heard of Hobby Lobby. What's wrong with them? That map is pretty funny.
@ Kasey: The beach, the mountains to play in the snow, and then drive home. There are a lot of good paying jobs here, usually. I wouldn't really call it "weather" but the lack of it.
I hope no one is hurt. But I feel sympathy for them like I feel sympathy for idiots who buy McMansions on stilts on the Gulf Coast and then ask for pity when a hurricane strikes.
19 comments:
To a certain extent, this is Gifford Pinchot's fault - first in the West to state that mankind could conquer fire. So now there are generation's worth of fuel in those hills - which in an unmanaged state would have frequent mild fires.
Good point Dave.
The Lancaster air tankers are grounded because of rotor winds. Talking about thousand foot pockets.
Are those wood shake roofs? Cheap, and deadly.
The Corona fire is blowing up. A few less REOs to deal with.
Scary thought; Terrorists with a van and accelerants. Good thing they are too stupid to think of it.
From jingle mail to smoke signals.
Some of those newer neighborhods do pretty well in a wildfire. I am thinking of Foothill Ranch and Stevenson Ranch in particular. Often they are required to have sprinkler systems in the houses. That is the reason they can build them so close together. But I don't see the usual surrounding greenbelt in this picture.
Those are brand new houses. You can still pick one up starting at $554,000. Act now, won't last!
Re: stick housing
During a trip across Europe one time I couldn't help but notice, seeing houses under construction in various places, that almost ALL homes there are built of brick, stone or cinder block. You rarely see the plywood mansions so ubiquitous in the states. When I see new homes going up here in the U.S. now they look even flimsier in my eyes than before. I can't believe we build like this, especially in areas prone to fire or hurricanes/tornadoes. Stone and brick may be more expensive in the beginning but I think it pays for itself in endurance.
Thin shell concrete domes also do well.
Something as simply as using a tile or metal roof w/ sprinklers would also help.
But even forgetting trees - brush grows back quickly in the southern CA desert.
Unless they are surrounded by 100 ft. of gravel (or something else that can't burn) houses in these locations are still at risk.
Honest question that may seem ignorant.
What's the draw to California? Outside of those wanting to make it in show biz. You have high prices, low wages, high housing prices, fires every year, high deficit.
Honestly, what is the draw?
@ Kasey:
The weather is outrageous.
Bennie B. lit the fire to get rid of excess inventory. I would rather have it all burn down than see the deadbeats get cram-downs and rates below what solid citizens can get.
Hi Edgar!
There may be many, many things wrong with California, but at least we don't have Hobby Lobby stores ;).
Kasey,
Shhhhh! California is a multi-generational experiment in the limits of cognitive dissonance. If the residents ever find out what's going on, they might wake up and want to come HERE.
By the way, having 300 days of sunny and dry weather isn't so impressive when you're on fire for 100 of those days.
I'm amazed by how fast things grow back here. I hear talk that burned areas will take years to return to normal. I'm used to things taking decades to grow back. Many decades. I suppose it would be the same here if some of the remaining evergreens burned.
Re stick-built houses, the thing is that they tend to do better in earthquakes. Unreinforced brick is pretty much a disaster waiting to happen in earthquake country, and it'll still burn if you ask nicely enough. Just look at all the 19th century brick towns that burned.
@ Akubi:
I've never heard of Hobby Lobby. What's wrong with them? That map is pretty funny.
@ Kasey: The beach, the mountains to play in the snow, and then drive home. There are a lot of good paying jobs here, usually. I wouldn't really call it "weather" but the lack of it.
Good time to turn an underwater house into an insurance claim. Is it just me or do the houses on fire look a little more random?
I hope no one is hurt. But I feel sympathy for them like I feel sympathy for idiots who buy McMansions on stilts on the Gulf Coast and then ask for pity when a hurricane strikes.
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