Housing Bubble, credit bubble, public planning, land use, zoning and transportation in the exurban environment. Specific criticism of smart growth, neotradtional, forms based, new urbanism and other top down planner schemes to increase urban extent and density. Ventura County, California specific examples.
Sunday, July 15, 2007
CH.C Open Forum
The meltdown at CH.C has been difficult to watch from afar. At the request of several people this top post is available for those who cannot get satisfaction there. It is postdated and will remain topmost until this evening. Try to play nice.
@ Mort, your clicky link to CH.c didn't work, but the comment is posted at IAFF and I just read it there. Pretty sad state. The one time I was at the forum I saw the trend of the comments in that regard and left. I really like The Dude, though.
There is no *meltdown*. There are a few people who are disaffected with the moderation at CHC.
And there appear to be a few who would like nothing better that to give the *impression* that there's a meltdown, or that there's a feud between EN and CHC.
I went over to CHC and found the signal to noise ratio rather low. It is also very hard to skim through responses.
I did find that Tracy was sometimes going out on a ledge.. but not doing what Edgar, AKA Mort was alleging to. Her comments were to the effect that Rob didn't mind talk about a minor until that minor was Robs daughter. She was using Casey's sister as an example. This does not match the facts. I get the feeling that she got caught up in the snarkiness that was going on.
The previous comment to the one that was linked by Edgar, AKA Mort was more indicting.
The Dudes attitude is much like its his ball and he will take it away if he wants to.. which is fundamentally true, but also can run counter to a healthy blog.
There is no *meltdown*. There are a few people who are disaffected with the moderation at CHC.
And there appear to be a few who would like nothing better that to give the *impression* that there's a meltdown, or that there's a feud between EN and CHC.
i don't give a shit which service i need to use. start your own blog if you feel like it. christ you're spoiled brats, ten blogs, a wiki, a forum, and five talkshoes. maybe tracy's a shitty mod and maybe the dude does not care. live with it. it's not like he's invented water over there.
@ Mort, OMG, when I was Infidel Woman? Kewel! That was a great handle, I should not have let the sock puppet troll taint it so easily. Which pic do you have?
I thought you were talking about the comment at CH.c about Alpha Dawg. It is posted at IAFF. I will go get it. brb
As a moderator, I get automatically copied into any alerts - and the number I've received in total, during the entire lifespan of CH.com, is still in single figures.
And only a small proportion of those were worth taking seriously.
I went over to CHC and found the signal to noise ratio rather low. It is also very hard to skim through responses.
Ditto. This isn't due to the moderation, it's due to the interface. It's hard to find "the latest" there, and while the avatars and graphics are funny they take up space.
With a blogger.com message stream I can simply hit reload.
miguel, I tried several times to register over there but never got a confirmation email. I wouldn't consider it a meltdown. more of a dud IMO. I checked my junk box and spam block and found no confirm emails
I also found that it was due to the posters over there. Very few of the statements that bloggers made over there, directly addressed what someone had stated. It as more "me too, I want to say something". The 'quoting' was easier there, but the display of the quotes was awkward (nested boxes).
I tried several times to register over there but never got a confirmation email. I wouldn't consider it a meltdown. more of a dud IMO.
Maybe you were just 'denied'. I got the impression that the confirmation actually goes through a person who does some checking. It is not a 'computer only' thing.
@ Mort, Oh, that one. Thanks. I see you edited out her "globes" as Rob Dawg called them. She is beautiful and an optical illusion. Too much for EN I decided. he he
Well, get a bunch of clowns together and that's what happens.
CHC wasn't created because EN was lacking anything of substance. CHC was created so a group of lonely people could attempt to fill a void in their lives.
There's nothing wrong with EN. These people just couldn't get their needs filled here.
Sorry Annie, I am not an attention whore. Nor do I kiss ass. I am so glad that since Sir Duane has decreed that he wants a "civil debate" with me on air he thinks I will hop to it. "Screw you, bitch", remember that little gem Mr. Southern Gentleman? I have absolutely nothing to debate with either Duane or Mark - they are the ones who wanted their names in the spotlight, not me. Nothing to debate here - I know what I believe, and that is good enough for me. Frankly I don't give a damn if anybody thinks I am right or wrong - too bad it is an obsession with Mark and Duane.
I have not offered to assist anyone who chronicled their crimes in detail for me - the two "professional businessmen" did. If you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas, right??
BTW, where is Tracy with her filthy trash mouth? The broad for whom the word "c*nt" seems to be second nature? Attention whore once again springs to mind.
I agree too. Most of the posters there are just seeking attention. They aren't there to discuss real estate, mortgage fraud, business, or many other topics that Mr. Serin invokes. Casey is just what brought them together. Most of the discussions there show that they care more about feeling needed by each other than anything else. Pretty sad when you think about it. Kinda weird too.
That Tracy person is showing her true addictive personality now. Expect the crash to come within a day or two.
"Most of the posters there are just seeking attention"
I'm just bored. I'm between jobs, got rid of my house, trying to get rid of my wife and I'm fairly unmotivated to do much besides kibitz and laugh a bit.
Just wanted to let everyone know that I was “banned for life” for expressing my views and opinions in a rational manner. The First Amendment goes out the window on CHC, it looks like. My posts towards Duane were not obscene in the least, but I am the one that got booted? Immediately after he said, “Screw you, b**** ” to me? Give me a break. Duane LeGate is in business to make money - he is not in business for “philanthropic” reasons. If Tracy prefers to boot those that oppose her views so be it - at least you would never hear me on the air screaming the word “c*nt” over and over, completely out of control - and she thinks it is ME that has a problem??? Her posts are vile, obscene, derogatory and inflammatory, but yet she will be allowed to always be in the right on CHC??? To the extreme of banning the other regular posters, who are the ONLY reason this forum will survive - whatever happened to free speech?? My guy fighting over in Iraq would be so proud that an uneducated person such as Tracy is allowed to govern the beliefs and viewpoints of other fellow Americans …………
Oh and Tracy - I will remind everyone at least several times a day just how narrow minded and vacuous you really are….
Thanks, Rob. I emailed Rob earlier tonight asking for a post to discuss CHC free from Stanley's (aka The Dude) from interfering in a free and open discussion about the management of his blog. Stanley created a thread to address questions and concerns from forum members, but has refused to answer questions.
I told Stanley that I wouldn't cross-post unless he started deleting content, which he immediately did. So here is a brief recap. I'll just cross-post the thread, unadulterated:
Stanley: OK...all those members with questions and concerns. Here's your chance to get answers.
I am going to ask NO MODS contribute to this thread. I want ONE voice speaking for the board in this instance.
I've got a pretty good track record for being reasonable so it's a legit question or concern, ask away. If a member wants to get cute or abuse the opportunity...don't.
Your turn.....
WaltStanley, I'd like to thank you for starting this thread. I think that it will be a helpful means of clarifying the limits of acceptable behavior on the part of both long-time, established posters and the moderators.
There are a number of concerns that I have, but I will start with my original post that resulted in the warning that I have asked you to review: "Seriously, (Galina's) got a fresh face and a nice body. The girl could make a lot of easy money doing private webcam shows.
"If I were hot and female, I'd do webcams. Unfortunately for me, there's not a huge market for slightly pudgy white guys."
Please comment on whether or not you personally find that brief post to objectionable or not.
In my mind, the comment was not vulgar and simply offered an observation that she could make money doing a webcam show on the internet. Moreover, the second half of my comment was self-deprecating in nature.
So let's please start with a discussion on this topic.
Stanley: No, we will start with this you posted in Suggestions:
"I would respectfully request that Honestly Wondering be relieved of his/her responsibilities as a moderator."
You think this is a constructive manner in which to voice any concerns you might have or would it fall into the category of "flame"?
Walt: Stanley, we should look at the events in chronological order so that people can understand what motivated that posting. You had stated that the purpose for the forum was to address OUR concerns and questions. I will answer your question in due course.
To that end, here is the PM exchange that led to that comment:
Honestly Wondering: "Walt, over the line. Consider this a warning."
walt526: "You've got to be kidding me."
Honestly Wondering: "No, I'm not. Don't push it."
(note: I interpreted this as a threat to ban me)
walt526: "You really need to get over yourself. I just made the observation that she could make a lot of money doing webcams. Nothing vulgar or inappropriate in any of the language used. YOU are stepping over the line, my friend."
At that point, I made my post suggesting that Honestly Wondering be relieved of his responsibilities as moderator. It was not a flame, but rather I was curious if other posters had similar issues with HW. I didn't call him a name, attack him personally, or the like. I just stated that I had a problem with the way that he executed his moderating duties. The post was made public to give other posters a chance to weigh in on any other similar incidents, if they had occurred.
So no, I don't see how a reasonable person could claim that the post was a flame in any way. Given what occurred this afternoon, I don't think that Honestly Wondering is a good moderator. He overreacted and abused his position. All I did was solicit other opinions to see if other people had similar experiences with him.
You deleted (or made invisible) my earlier thread, but at this time I would invite all members to come forward with any incidents of abuse from Honestly Wondering, Tracy, or any other moderators. And I would ask that you carefully review each and every one and take appropriate corrective action as necessary.
So, back to my original question: why was my post about Galina making money doing a webcam objectionable?
Stanley:If you believe you are going to control this thread, you are sadly mistaken. I stated that my question is where my response will begin. Either answer or your time for questions is at an end and I'll move on to the next member.
Walt: Stanley, re-read the post. I did answer your question with respect to whether or not my suggestion to remove HW as a moderator constituted a "flame."
Rather than get into a pissing match over "control" of the thread, why don't we just answer each others questions and concerns in a polite, adult manner. Again, a courteousy that I have afforded you, Tracy, HW, an indeed all CH.C posters throughout my time here. It would be appropriate for you to reciprocate.
In any event, I'll repost my response:
"At that point, I made my post suggesting that Honestly Wondering be relieved of his responsibilities as moderator. It was not a flame, but rather I was curious if other posters had similar issues with HW. I didn't call him a name, attack him personally, or the like. I just stated that I had a problem with the way that he executed his moderating duties. The post was made public to give other posters a chance to weigh in on any other similar incidents, if they had occurred.
"So no, I don't see how a reasonable person could claim that the post was a flame in any way. Given what occurred this afternoon, I don't think that Honestly Wondering is a good moderator. He overreacted and abused his position. All I did was solicit other opinions to see if other people had similar experiences with him.
"You deleted (or made invisible) my earlier thread, but at this time I would invite all members to come forward with any incidents of abuse from Honestly Wondering, Tracy, or any other moderators. And I would ask that you carefully review each and every one and take appropriate corrective action as necessary."
NOTE: Stanley deleted this post and wrote:Content deleted:
Last chance for you to answer the question.
Walt:I simply quoted my earlier response, in which I did respond to his question directly. He has yet to respond to any of my concerns or questions, which afterall was the purpose of this thread.
No, I don't see it as a flame. Removing moderators who act inappropriately is constructive criticism and serves the better interest of this blog.
Stanley: Removal of Moderators is not your responsibility; nor are you responsible for their performance review. Criticism or concerns about board policy and leadership should be communicated privately. I'm not buying your "serving the board" response so stop trying to sell it. You were flaming a Mod and you know it. If you were TRULY concerned, you would have left it in PM.
Walt: We will have to agree to disagree on whether or not my posting constituted a flame. A flame typically an ad hominem attack, name calling, etc. I simply stated that I found his behavior to be unacceptable. Nothing more. Nothing less. A fair-minded person would not call that a flame.
Stanley has yet to respond to this post.
Stanley (responding to another poster): Yes, to the same standards and HIGHER....including me. This has been a MADHOUSE this past week. We've barely been able to keep things going with all the volume of members and posts. We are working hard on getting all this down ASAP.
Has everyone, including Mods and myself, always responded properly? NO Are we addressing how to best respond and best serve the membership? YES Will we make mistakes? YES Will we work to improve? YES
Thanks....We tackled a very difficult undertaking as best we could as fast as we could.
Walt: Stanley, I appreciate you owning up the fact that you and your moderators have made a number of mistakes in the forum's first week. As I said on earlier thread, we can drop this whole matter if the warning is withdrawn. In return, I will apologize for starting a thread that you believe constituted a flame if HW's feeling were hurt in anyway.
Do we have a deal?
Stanley:I am not "negotiating" in this thread. I am answering questions and concerns as best I can.
Walt: Okay. Feel free to chime into the Haterz Cast tonight if you wish.
EDIT: If you are not up to negotiating a settlement to this mess, will you please now answer my original question: what was objectionable about my original post concerning Galina doing a webcam. We may not agree on it, but its in everyone's interest to fully understand where the line between acceptable and unacceptable behavior is.
Yep, they got some Freddy Kruger psychos moderating that board. Heil Hitler! Lick the fascist boot. Chop, chop, of with your head. I dissed duane (i.e. told the truth about him) one time and got shouted down. You get the same thing over here. And for god's sake, don't be banging on that lost mittens freak either. LOL.
Is it a meltdown or just a tiff between a poster and a forum administrator? Well since this issue has arised, I've gotten nearly a dozen PMs from CHC members who are very dissatisfied with the Stanley and Tracy (aka The Dude and T) and the rest of the merry band of moderators have run the new site.
LawnmowerMan PMed me and said that he flagged my comment, not because it was over the line in itself, but that it could lead to responses that would be. I've enjoyed LMM posts over the past several months, and we'll just have to disagree here. Again, my comment was not vulgar or overly offensive. If anything, I was more insulting TO MYSELF than Galina with the crack about my weight/appearance.
This issue is more than just some stupid comment that I made, that may or may not have been in bad taste. Rather, it's whether we as The Haterz Community should restrict our discussion with the pseudo-fascist constraints on free speech. Stanley and Tracy started CHC because they claimed that Rob Dawg controlled the discussion too much. I disagree with that assessment, but I think that we need to discuss how they're much worse (IMHO) than Rob ever was.
i believe walt would like it acknowledged that he is not wrong. i dont think he is but then again he was not given respect either it came off wrong and thedude defended instead of answering
I just want to give those who are considering "jumping ship" to CHC realize that the management over there is much more juvenile, arbitrary, and overbearing than Rob ever was. I am hoping that a candid public discussion about everyone's issues (whether with Rob, Stanley, Tracy, or whoever) will result in a forum (either here, CHC, or elsewhere) where we can converse freely so long as we are tasteful with our comments about the fucktard that is Casey K Serin.
Stanley and Tracy started CHC because they claimed that Rob Dawg controlled the discussion too much.
That's not my understanding of the genesis of CHC. But I wasn't a party to it, so it's not my place to say.
What I will say, though, is that I largely moved to CHC not because the conversation here was too controlled, but because it was not controlled *enough*. At the time, the trolls on EN were making it all but unreadable. CHC offered a troll-free environment that was very attractive.
Here is another exchange within the same thread between Stanley and myself regarding whether or not I should cross-post to EN (I decided to do so only after he started deleting benign comments of mine).
Walt: Stanley,
I'd like to cross-post this topic to EN, to get some outsider perspective as well. Do you have any objection to me doing so?
...
Stanley: Yes, I would. What goes on here is our business and our business only. I could care less what "an outsider"'s point of view is.
...
Walt:
Well the purpose wouldn't have been to solicit any sort of binding input, but to get a fresh, unbiased perspective from our fellow Haterz. The manner in which this forum is (mis)managed is of general interest to the broader Caseyverse, not just simply those who have migrated over to here.
But I respect your desire on this matter and will honor your wish to keep this "in-house" so long as you do not delete any content
...
Stanley: The manner in which this board is managed is none of their business....just as how another board is managed is none of my business
...
Walt: Well your entire selling point for this forum is that Cote mismanaged EN. It seems only fair that potential participants of CH.C be exposed to possible mismanagement on your part as well. This thread is not for your benefit, but for the benefit of the "Haterz Community" as a whole.
But as I said, I will not cross-post. However, I'm keeping a record of this thread and will cross-post it in its entirety if you were to delete it.
...
Stanley: Question for clarity: Are you saying you will cross post content from this board should I decide to move or delete content from my own board?
...
Walt You're deleting content without justification and you're not answering direct questions. Obviously, this is a discussion that needs to occur on a neutral forum. I have asked Rob if he would be willing to provide a topic on EN for its discussion. In addition, I will raise these concerns during tonight's Haterzcast.
...
Stanley: This board's business stays on this board.....period. I cannot make it any clearer. The proper manner in which to address board issues in on the board. To take our business elsewhere is not in the best interest of the board.
...
Walt:
No, not if you are going to impede an honest, neutral discussion of the issues. I invite you to call up the HaterzCast and we can talk directly about CH.C's management problems.
In any event, I'm more interested in the best interests of the Haterz Community as a whole, not this forum. As are most people, I believe.
...
Stanley: Then, you do what you think is right and I will do the same
...
Sometime around when I posted about him deleting my content, I sent this email to Rob:
Subject: Management of CHC
Rob,
I don't know if you've been following today's developments with regards to CH.C over there, but there's a huge meltdown going on among several posters (including myself) and the pseudo-fascist management of The Dude and Tracy. Would you be willing to allow EN to serve as a forum to have an open discussion about these concerns? The Dude keeps deleting our comments without cause.
I'm asking if you'd set up a special topic so that those of us who frequent both sites to carry on an open, honest discussion. But I wanted to get your blessing before contaminating EN with it.
Stanley finally posted a response to my question, with regard to whether or not my original post was over the line:
Sure...that's exactly what the Mods and I are working on right now. The problem it this. We try and keep discussions open and people are pretty much allowed to express their opinion. In order to do that, we can't have a rigid set of rules with a two foot wide line saying "here and no further". What we CAN do is have have policies and procedures in place to address what one person feels is appropriate. In the end, it comes down to a judgment call....one the other person isn't going to agree with. Such is the nature of message boards.
To try and get as SPECIFIC as I can, without going back and reading the entire thread, I suppose it would depend on where you were taking the comment. If I am going to make a call right now based on what you included, I would interpret that it to mean she could charge money for behavior via the webcam. I would have sent you a PM and say....that's a little over the line. She's not given any indication she would behave in that manner so to imply that's a way to make money, is wrong. You could agree or disagree, but in the end, my word will be the last one. I'm not pulling rank, but someone has to have the last word and make the call....goes with the territory.
I learned a long time ago I cannot make everyone happy so I don't try. I do the best I can and if anyone wants to leave and form their own board or find some place better suited to them.....Leave and go with my best wishes. However, I'm not going to have endless debate and argue over board policy or acceptable behavior. Members will respect Mods and their decisions. Mods will respect members and enforce board policy in a fair manner. I'm telling you folks.....other than a few misunderstandings or bad days....these Mods have worked their ass off for you. Over 10,000 freakin' posts and we spend an entire afternoon pissed at a handful. Let's put things into perspective....and if there's a wrong, it will be made right....by all paries. Once we finish with everything and get it posted, each and every member will have to ask themselves...do I want to stay or do I want to leave? Unless you have another topic, this closed this one.
@CSL: Why does there have to be a goal LMM? What exactly is your goal in caring?
My goal is that EN and CHC coexist peaceably without a few individuals stirring up a phony feud between them.
It's divisive. And it feels to me a little like the division is being fed to add some extra drama to saga. Casey's actions aren't enough -- now we have to turn on each other? Please.
LMM, I really appreciate the hard work on Caseypedia, but with all due respect, I got the evidence right here in the car. Jackie Gleason aka Buford T. Justice: Put the evidence in the car...
Stanley has just deleted or closed the thread (or maybe I've been banned?) before I could respond. So here's my response:
Walt: Again, I appreciate that you recognized that you have some issues to resolve with your moderators.
Now I take issue with you deleting earlier content. My understanding was that comments would be edited for vulgarity. Why did YOU delete my content on this thread earlier?
Again, the issue that we have here is not about whether or not my comment was over-the-line or not. It's whether or not the moderators are able/willing to provide a forum for free and open discussion. Banning posters (or threatening to do so) or deleting comment should only be done if the content is obscene or personally insulting. Not if the moderator/administrator just happens to disagree with the substance of the post.
Yeah, apparently I've been banned from CHC. People can decide for themselves whether or not that action was appropriate. I would suggest that people remain at EN if they want a free, unfiltered conversation.
Hmmmm, over 10,000 posts and 10% of them are Tracy's. Yeah, she is really working her ass off for "you". Someone has a major ego issue when it comes to reading their own comments....
"Members will respect Mods and their decisions. Mods will respect members and enforce board policy in a fair manner."
How was I respected, Stanley??? No advance warning from YOUR moderators and then no explanation as to why afterwards. In fact, if I had not emailed you during the night I still would have no clue why I couldn't log in. Your response that I should email Tracy to try and work is out was not even worth responding to. But I most politely did, told you that Tracy was not worth the time and wished you well, correct?
What makes you so certain it was my exclusive decision to have you banned? Surely you realize that by banning people, I will put a muzzle also on myself, right? And no one likes to talk shit more than me. So maybe you should get all the facts straight before you jump to conclusions.
Anything I had to say to you I did via PM. I'm a direct person' surely you know this?
If you or anyone else would like to talk to me, ream me a new one, or whatever... feel free to email me @ nachocat@msn.com
Y'know, I wouldn't devote any posts at all to the brou-ha-has that may or may not be occurring over at CHC.
Fact of the matter is that many people drummed their heels and stuffed maxi-pads into their hemmorhaging orifices with both hands about how you ran things here, and left in a huff to go pitch camp there.
Now they're there...let them and their basket of woes STAY there.
The target is Casey...not petit primadonnas who want to be the bride at every wedding and the corpse at every funeral.
Of course it was your exclusive decision. And how was I supposed to get your PM when I was kicked off with no notice. For the record, I NEVER received a PM, nor an email from you regarding anything.
You did this to yourself Tracy - and there are a LOT of people out there that have no respect for you because of your actions. Let me remind you of some of your insufferable remarks:
"Tracy, as I said in my PM response, thank you for your feedback. But I'd like to talk about this issue directly with The Dude."
Just so you know, The Dude will back what the mods and I do and say. We are a team. So your attempt to go "straight to the top" will probably be a waste of time. If you think you can divide and conquer... you are mistaken.
But by all means, have a go at it."
Nice one Tracy, how about this one:
"This is not your decision to make. We hand-selected the mods and we're quite happy with our choices.
I would like to respectfully add that if you are unhappy with the management, you are more than welcome to leave and not come back."
And the biggest gem of all which contradicts your stating that no one should be insulted and makes me wonder why you are downright lying about ever sending me a PM. Are you already falling down on the job - only three, oops sory Walt, four people banned and you have already forgotten to warn on of them in advance:
"To the moderators:
How many people altogether have been banned? What led to their being asked to leave?"
Not that it's anyone's business other than The Dude's and we mods, however, three people have been banned.
1 - slimunit 2 - just silly me 3 - casey's sex life
There has been no ban on Pink Lips. Maybe she should try to register before she takes her medication with a whiskey chaser and she's be able to do it properly?
The mods and admin make collective decisions regarding banning. I prefer not to ban anyone, however, when we continue to get numerous complaints from long-time members, we must make a collective decision.
We don't make those decisions lightly and they are only made after several attempts via PM are made to work it out amicably.
I am usually the one PMing to try to work it out and, other than The Dude, I am the only other person able to actually ban which is why they're attacking me about it. Oh, well.
Luckily, I don't base my self-esteem on what others think of me, so if they want to blame me, fine... have at it."
ATTENTION PEOPLE!! Will someone please take a look at the picture OCP provided and identify which one is duane? Come on now, you know we're gonna find out anyway.
@ LMM My goal is that EN and CHC coexist peaceably without a few individuals stirring up a phony feud between them.
Before this evening, that was my goal as well. Unfortunately I underestimated how juvenile and petty Stanley and Tracy are. But clearly they are not up for the challenges of running a successful forum.
I would encourage all my fellow Haterz to abandon CHC. What I wrote is up here for anyone to see--was anything so vulgar or insulting to warrant a ban? I don't think so. Rob may not be perfect, but he is a much worthier custodian of the Haterz forums.
BTW Tracy, the Dude already told me last night that he had no clue about me being banned. So if you and he are the only ones with the "exclusive right" to ban anyone how was this NOT an exclusive decision by you and you only??
The Dude asked me to email you to see if I could work it out so that I could be "allowed" back into CHC. I politely told him thanks, but no thanks - I felt no need to try and ask for ANYTHIING from you.
By you acting like a bigshot yesterday and banning me, you are now paying the dear price of fame. People DO NOT like you.
I wasn't impressed with CHC and still prefer EN. I'm surprised people are complaining about too much moderation because I thought there was none! There seemed to be multiple threads for each topic, and most of the comments seemed to be bitching about how much everyone hated EN, or how much they hate other haterz. Even if that stuff was funny in the beginning, it gets old fast.
CHC seems to be nothing more than one big high school game, with everyone joining a clique and turning on each other.
Tracy was entertaining at times when she was obsessed with Turdflake, but she is clearly not an emotionally stable person. I was hoping to have an adult, candid discussion with Stanley, who I had hoped would be reasonable. But oh well. Like Tracy said, he's her bitch.
But people, seriously let's keep the conversation at EN, where we can trust Rob to provide a free forum for discussing the trainwreck that is our favorite little fliptard.
CHC seems to be nothing more than one big high school game, with everyone joining a clique and turning on each other.
That's a pretty good way of putting it. A less polite way would be to say that it's a clusterfuck or circle jerk among a few petty "loosers" who have nothing else worthwhile in this world.
There (CHC)seemed to be multiple threads for each topic, and most of the comments seemed to be bitching about how much everyone hated EN, or how much they hate other haterz. Even if that stuff was funny in the beginning, it gets old fast.
Indeed. Half of Tracy's posts involve a little head of Rob from that dreadful picture of him saying something insulting.
Hell, half the posts at CHC are Tracys or Dudes.........
Well let's be fair: the first few days of CHC were impressive in terms of response from Haterz. Unfortunately, this came at the expense of EN, which I'm guilty as anyone in terms of attention. CHC is the hot new thing and as a forum it is somewhat easier to follow than EN (although EN's gotten a lot better since registration was required). But if Stanley and Tracy continue pissing off longtime Haterz, there going to find their site vacant rather quick.
One question - now that Duane is NOT buying the blog will this be the last we hear from him??? Please? Why do these two men waste so much time on Casey? Now they are discussing Galina's motives and decisions. This is beyond bizarre.
Just curious why I was banned at CHC. None of my comments were vulgar, disrespectful, or offensive.
I don't really care, just curious about your reasoning.
-Walt
I'll post any response at EN.
...
@ CSL One question - now that Duane is NOT buying the blog will this be the last we hear from him??? Please? Why do these two men waste so much time on Casey? Now they are discussing Galina's motives and decisions. This is beyond bizarre.
I don't know why those two are still wasting time and company's reputations with Casey.
But honestly, I don't know why *I* am still interested in this thing. This thing has really run its course and it's probably time to move on. For ALL of us, myself included.
This is my last evening with this drivel. Duane and Mark have totally trashed their reputations - people on IAFF are more for Casey because they can't stand these guys.
Alexa traffic comparison of EN, CHC and IAFF websites. Rising traffic across all three, although it looks like CHC cut into somme of IAFF's traffic for a day or two.
Indeed its time to move on from this bizarre saga. Before I go I want to apologize to Rob, Mark and Duane for some of my offending posts. I don't know you guys but in the end you seem like stand up individuals. I believe that Duane is communicating with Galina and that she has no intention of getting back together with KC if he pays her bills or not. Good for you Galina. KC is totally screwed and he's gonna loose his blog. Duane and Mark are going to sell it and give Galina the proceeds, good for you guys. Rob sorry for some of the comments towards you I was just fueling the fire but I realize now that Casey IS just a con artist and these guys are going after him because no one else would. In the end he's finished. His tax bill alone is going to kill him.. IRS debt can't be forgiven in bankruptcy so its game over got KC. Anyhow its been fun but its not fun anymore. I hope you post up a link to donate to Galina I'd donate.
Respectfully, if you don't think that there's a major problem brewing at CHC, then you're simply not paying attention. When I was debating back and forth this evening with Tracy and Stanley, there was a flood of PMs supporting me for having the stones to stand up to those two fucktwits. Maybe they banned me because they were afraid that I was going to start cross-posting those on EN as well?
I don't know, and I don't really care. I will say that those two are toxic and given enough time, eventually the Haterz masses will leave CHC for greener pastures, either by returning to EN or going to a new forum. Although with the Turdflake story winding down, it's possible that everyone will move on before that happens.
But I'd seriously reconsider whether or not you want to willingly associate with those two. They are nearly as toxic as Casey.
BTW, no response yet from Stanley tonight from my email asking for an explanation regarding my ban from CHC. If he could defend it, he would. But I think that he knows that he can't answer the inquiry without further revealing what a little fucktwit he and Tracy are.
Stanley: If you don't care, my reasoning won't matter.....LOL
Good luck and Best Wishe
...
Walt: Stanley,
I'm only asking because I've gotten a few inquiries on EN and via email about it and want to know if there's an actual reason. So what was the last straw? Inquiring minds want to know.
-Walt
So let's see what he comes back with. Until proven otherwise, he and Tracy are both fucktwits and bullies as far as I'm concerned.
Sounds like people are getting too worked up about message board drama...
Seriously, this Casey stuff is supposed to be all shits and giggles (for us outsiders, at least). If it's getting you upset you should probably take a step back and disconnect for a while.
Wow, what happened overnight at CH.C? Bummer on the bannings-- I thought Casey's Sex Life's postings there were amusing. I've been trying to get caught up on everything that happened in the last 15 hours, and good lord!
Interesting post by LMP-- should be some fireworks soon... I've been amazed that Casey could think to welsh so thoroughly on a settlement! What a looser...
Some people like their format better than EN's. I was never there long enough to really get a feel for it, but it does offer some advantages over Blogger.
Unfortunately, it also means interacting with the two little children over there who run it. I disagree with Rob on pretty much everything politically, but the man does have intellectual integrity. That's a lot more than you can say about Stanley (aka The Dude).
The comment in itself is immaterial. The issue that I (and apparently several others) have is the manner in which "the standards" are established and enforced. That was the principle that I was defending, not my right to make some asinine comment about Galina.
People who focus on that one, throw-away line are missing the big picture, IMHO.
The meltdown at CH.C has been difficult to watch from afar. At the request of several people this top post is available for those who cannot get satisfaction there. It is postdated and will remain topmost until this evening. Try to play nice.
122 comments:
Could you tell me where this "meltdown" is happening? I'm one of the moderators, and I can't find it anywhere.
Oh, and first.
Worst!
Murst Loozer Beiotchez!!!!!!!!!
Hi Mort!!!
YES!!! Thanks Rob!
Miguel - many many people are disgusted. Tracy is a joke and Dude has said put up or shut up. The tide is turning back to EN or else to a new forum.
I never left EN.
I did leave Housing Panic to come here though.
heh
@ Mort, your clicky link to CH.c didn't work, but the comment is posted at IAFF and I just read it there. Pretty sad state.
The one time I was at the forum I saw the trend of the comments in that regard and left.
I really like The Dude, though.
Oh, FFS.
There is no *meltdown*. There are a few people who are disaffected with the moderation at CHC.
And there appear to be a few who would like nothing better that to give the *impression* that there's a meltdown, or that there's a feud between EN and CHC.
Storm in a teacup, IMHO.
Hi FMW! You da bee's knees. You sed:
...but the comment is posted at IAFF and I just read it there.
Huh? What comment? I used one of your IW pics, that's what I wanted you to see. Do you have a linky for the comment in question?
Still haven't found this "meltdown".
I've even trawled through the mods forum, where one would expect to find a panic-stricken discussion, and have drawn a complete blank.
I went over to CHC and found the signal to noise ratio rather low. It is also very hard to skim through responses.
I did find that Tracy was sometimes going out on a ledge.. but not doing what Edgar, AKA Mort was alleging to. Her comments were to the effect that Rob didn't mind talk about a minor until that minor was Robs daughter. She was using Casey's sister as an example. This does not match the facts. I get the feeling that she got caught up in the snarkiness that was going on.
The previous comment to the one that was linked by Edgar, AKA Mort was more indicting.
The Dudes attitude is much like its his ball and he will take it away if he wants to.. which is fundamentally true, but also can run counter to a healthy blog.
Quoted for emphasis:
There is no *meltdown*. There are a few people who are disaffected with the moderation at CHC.
And there appear to be a few who would like nothing better that to give the *impression* that there's a meltdown, or that there's a feud between EN and CHC.
Casey's Sex Life -
If you are lurking here - call in to the talk cast. Duane wants to talk.
i don't give a shit which service i need to use. start your own blog if you feel like it. christ you're spoiled brats, ten blogs, a wiki, a forum, and five talkshoes. maybe tracy's a shitty mod and maybe the dude does not care. live with it. it's not like he's invented water over there.
@ Mort,
OMG, when I was Infidel Woman? Kewel!
That was a great handle, I should not have let the sock puppet troll taint it so easily.
Which pic do you have?
I thought you were talking about the comment at CH.c about Alpha Dawg.
It is posted at IAFF. I will go get it.
brb
As a moderator, I get automatically copied into any alerts - and the number I've received in total, during the entire lifespan of CH.com, is still in single figures.
And only a small proportion of those were worth taking seriously.
This is a "meltdown", apparently.
I went over to CHC and found the signal to noise ratio rather low. It is also very hard to skim through responses.
Ditto. This isn't due to the moderation, it's due to the interface. It's hard to find "the latest" there, and while the avatars and graphics are funny they take up space.
With a blogger.com message stream I can simply hit reload.
@ Mort,
This post from CH.c supposedly and re posted at IAFF.
@ Rob,
I hope you do not mind Rob. Well, just delete it if I crossed a line.
Just Postin, not agreein.
PS: My son was threatened by an EN troll, it is not cool.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
#324. Tracy is a Clown
July 15th, 2007 at 3:18 pm
Hey Rob Dawg -
How do you like this being posted about you by Tracy, the “administrator” on CHC?
“Yes, his daughter.
It was ok when it was other children…like Casey’s little sister, but boy oh boy, did Cote draw the line when it came to HIS daughter.
Who the internet tried to rape.
In case he hadn’t told you already.”
KC posted that? Wow!
[link]
miguel,
I tried several times to register over there but never got a confirmation email. I wouldn't consider it a meltdown. more of a dud IMO. I checked my junk box and spam block and found no confirm emails
There's five pages of snark there.
@Lou Minatti
I also found that it was due to the posters over there. Very few of the statements that bloggers made over there, directly addressed what someone had stated. It as more "me too, I want to say something". The 'quoting' was easier there, but the display of the quotes was awkward (nested boxes).
@aaron
I tried several times to register over there but never got a confirmation email. I wouldn't consider it a meltdown. more of a dud IMO.
Maybe you were just 'denied'. I got the impression that the confirmation actually goes through a person who does some checking. It is not a 'computer only' thing.
Edgar, AKA Mort
There's five pages of snark there.
That is part of why I considered it to have a low signal to noise ratio.
@ Mort,
Oh, that one. Thanks.
I see you edited out her "globes" as Rob Dawg called them.
She is beautiful and an optical illusion. Too much for EN I decided.
he he
It was one of yours not too long ago, I had to crop her, ahem, stuff. Sorry.
@BJ sed:
...low signal to noise ratio.
What, are you one of them digital / fiber optic type persons or something?
@ Mort,
Are you registered at CaseyHaterz.com?
Or is the five pages of snark comment about IAFF?
@ Mort,
Are you registered at CaseyHaterz.com?
Or is the five pages of snark comment about IAFF?
Yep, I'm edgar's sister over there. (snark)
I guess you saw Akubi's doggie picture, what a hoot!
Well, get a bunch of clowns together and that's what happens.
CHC wasn't created because EN was lacking anything of substance. CHC was created so a group of lonely people could attempt to fill a void in their lives.
There's nothing wrong with EN. These people just couldn't get their needs filled here.
Ditto Lou Minatti. I found entertaining, but hard to read for the same reasons.
I want to thank the folks there for helping me to register last night, though.
I tried several times to register over there but never got a confirmation email.
Did you check your spam folder?
This is CSL -
Sorry Annie, I am not an attention whore. Nor do I kiss ass. I am so glad that since Sir Duane has decreed that he wants a "civil debate" with me on air he thinks I will hop to it. "Screw you, bitch", remember that little gem Mr. Southern Gentleman? I have absolutely nothing to debate with either Duane or Mark - they are the ones who wanted their names in the spotlight, not me. Nothing to debate here - I know what I believe, and that is good enough for me. Frankly I don't give a damn if anybody thinks I am right or wrong - too bad it is an obsession with Mark and Duane.
I have not offered to assist anyone who chronicled their crimes in detail for me - the two "professional businessmen" did. If you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas, right??
BTW, where is Tracy with her filthy trash mouth? The broad for whom the word "c*nt" seems to be second nature? Attention whore once again springs to mind.
Who opens a blogger account and uses the name anonymous? What a looser!
HA HA! CSL got the boot!
I agree too. Most of the posters there are just seeking attention. They aren't there to discuss real estate, mortgage fraud, business, or many other topics that Mr. Serin invokes. Casey is just what brought them together. Most of the discussions there show that they care more about feeling needed by each other than anything else. Pretty sad when you think about it. Kinda weird too.
That Tracy person is showing her true addictive personality now. Expect the crash to come within a day or two.
@ Mort,
Yep, saw the dog when I entered 6 degress to Casey Serin and Friday the 13th guy Jason Voorhees!
Your wabbits were just as cute.
Vote for me next week.
"Most of the posters there are just seeking attention"
I'm just bored. I'm between jobs, got rid of my house, trying to get rid of my wife and I'm fairly unmotivated to do much besides kibitz and laugh a bit.
Vote for me next week.
That's in the bag bebs. ;-)
The only posts worth reading at CHC are the ones they copy/pasted straight from EN.
Enough said.
This recent comment of KC's is simultaneously the funniest, and the most on target, thing he's said in a while.
...stop treating me like i’m some incompetent retard who needs adult supervision.
But, he is, he is!!!
endgame,,,, that goes without saying!
caseyssexlife,,, is there a way i can email you? i clicked on your name and cannot find an email addy.
The only posts worth reading at CHC are the ones they copy/pasted straight from EN.
Enough said.
lol
!@! Mort,
Thanks.
Sure thing, you can email me at:
caseyssexlife@gmail.com
From IAFF
#268. Caseys Sex Life
July 15th, 2007 at 8:54 am
Letter to CHC -
Just wanted to let everyone know that I was “banned for life” for expressing my views and opinions in a rational manner. The First Amendment goes out the window on CHC, it looks like. My posts towards Duane were not obscene in the least, but I am the one that got booted? Immediately after he said, “Screw you, b**** ” to me? Give me a break. Duane LeGate is in business to make money - he is not in business for “philanthropic” reasons. If Tracy prefers to boot those that oppose her views so be it - at least you would never hear me on the air screaming the word “c*nt” over and over, completely out of control - and she thinks it is ME that has a problem??? Her posts are vile, obscene, derogatory and inflammatory, but yet she will be allowed to always be in the right on CHC??? To the extreme of banning the other regular posters, who are the ONLY reason this forum will survive - whatever happened to free speech?? My guy fighting over in Iraq would be so proud that an uneducated person such as Tracy is allowed to govern the beliefs and viewpoints of other fellow Americans …………
Oh and Tracy - I will remind everyone at least several times a day just how narrow minded and vacuous you really are….
Thanks, Rob. I emailed Rob earlier tonight asking for a post to discuss CHC free from Stanley's (aka The Dude) from interfering in a free and open discussion about the management of his blog. Stanley created a thread to address questions and concerns from forum members, but has refused to answer questions.
I told Stanley that I wouldn't cross-post unless he started deleting content, which he immediately did. So here is a brief recap. I'll just cross-post the thread, unadulterated:
Stanley:
OK...all those members with questions and concerns. Here's your chance to get answers.
I am going to ask NO MODS contribute to this thread. I want ONE voice speaking for the board in this instance.
I've got a pretty good track record for being reasonable so it's a legit question or concern, ask away. If a member wants to get cute or abuse the opportunity...don't.
Your turn.....
WaltStanley, I'd like to thank you for starting this thread. I think that it will be a helpful means of clarifying the limits of acceptable behavior on the part of both long-time, established posters and the moderators.
There are a number of concerns that I have, but I will start with my original post that resulted in the warning that I have asked you to review:
"Seriously, (Galina's) got a fresh face and a nice body. The girl could make a lot of easy money doing private webcam shows.
"If I were hot and female, I'd do webcams. Unfortunately for me, there's not a huge market for slightly pudgy white guys."
Please comment on whether or not you personally find that brief post to objectionable or not.
In my mind, the comment was not vulgar and simply offered an observation that she could make money doing a webcam show on the internet. Moreover, the second half of my comment was self-deprecating in nature.
So let's please start with a discussion on this topic.
Thanks,
Walt
Stanley:
No, we will start with this you posted in Suggestions:
"I would respectfully request that Honestly Wondering be relieved of his/her responsibilities as a moderator."
You think this is a constructive manner in which to voice any concerns you might have or would it fall into the category of "flame"?
Walt:
Stanley, we should look at the events in chronological order so that people can understand what motivated that posting. You had stated that the purpose for the forum was to address OUR concerns and questions. I will answer your question in due course.
To that end, here is the PM exchange that led to that comment:
Honestly Wondering: "Walt, over the line. Consider this a warning."
walt526: "You've got to be kidding me."
Honestly Wondering: "No, I'm not. Don't push it."
(note: I interpreted this as a threat to ban me)
walt526: "You really need to get over yourself. I just made the observation that she could make a lot of money doing webcams. Nothing vulgar or inappropriate in any of the language used. YOU are stepping over the line, my friend."
At that point, I made my post suggesting that Honestly Wondering be relieved of his responsibilities as moderator. It was not a flame, but rather I was curious if other posters had similar issues with HW. I didn't call him a name, attack him personally, or the like. I just stated that I had a problem with the way that he executed his moderating duties. The post was made public to give other posters a chance to weigh in on any other similar incidents, if they had occurred.
So no, I don't see how a reasonable person could claim that the post was a flame in any way. Given what occurred this afternoon, I don't think that Honestly Wondering is a good moderator. He overreacted and abused his position. All I did was solicit other opinions to see if other people had similar experiences with him.
You deleted (or made invisible) my earlier thread, but at this time I would invite all members to come forward with any incidents of abuse from Honestly Wondering, Tracy, or any other moderators. And I would ask that you carefully review each and every one and take appropriate corrective action as necessary.
So, back to my original question: why was my post about Galina making money doing a webcam objectionable?
Stanley:If you believe you are going to control this thread, you are sadly mistaken. I stated that my question is where my response will begin. Either answer or your time for questions is at an end and I'll move on to the next member.
Walt:
Stanley, re-read the post. I did answer your question with respect to whether or not my suggestion to remove HW as a moderator constituted a "flame."
Rather than get into a pissing match over "control" of the thread, why don't we just answer each others questions and concerns in a polite, adult manner. Again, a courteousy that I have afforded you, Tracy, HW, an indeed all CH.C posters throughout my time here. It would be appropriate for you to reciprocate.
In any event, I'll repost my response:
"At that point, I made my post suggesting that Honestly Wondering be relieved of his responsibilities as moderator. It was not a flame, but rather I was curious if other posters had similar issues with HW. I didn't call him a name, attack him personally, or the like. I just stated that I had a problem with the way that he executed his moderating duties. The post was made public to give other posters a chance to weigh in on any other similar incidents, if they had occurred.
"So no, I don't see how a reasonable person could claim that the post was a flame in any way. Given what occurred this afternoon, I don't think that Honestly Wondering is a good moderator. He overreacted and abused his position. All I did was solicit other opinions to see if other people had similar experiences with him.
"You deleted (or made invisible) my earlier thread, but at this time I would invite all members to come forward with any incidents of abuse from Honestly Wondering, Tracy, or any other moderators. And I would ask that you carefully review each and every one and take appropriate corrective action as necessary."
NOTE: Stanley deleted this post and wrote:Content deleted:
Last chance for you to answer the question.
Walt:I simply quoted my earlier response, in which I did respond to his question directly. He has yet to respond to any of my concerns or questions, which afterall was the purpose of this thread.
No, I don't see it as a flame. Removing moderators who act inappropriately is constructive criticism and serves the better interest of this blog.
Stanley:
Removal of Moderators is not your responsibility; nor are you responsible for their performance review. Criticism or concerns about board policy and leadership should be communicated privately. I'm not buying your "serving the board" response so stop trying to sell it. You were flaming a Mod and you know it. If you were TRULY concerned, you would have left it in PM.
Walt:
We will have to agree to disagree on whether or not my posting constituted a flame. A flame typically an ad hominem attack, name calling, etc. I simply stated that I found his behavior to be unacceptable. Nothing more. Nothing less. A fair-minded person would not call that a flame.
Stanley has yet to respond to this post.
Stanley (responding to another poster):
Yes, to the same standards and HIGHER....including me. This has been a MADHOUSE this past week. We've barely been able to keep things going with all the volume of members and posts. We are working hard on getting all this down ASAP.
Has everyone, including Mods and myself, always responded properly? NO
Are we addressing how to best respond and best serve the membership? YES
Will we make mistakes? YES
Will we work to improve? YES
Thanks....We tackled a very difficult undertaking as best we could as fast as we could.
Walt:
Stanley, I appreciate you owning up the fact that you and your moderators have made a number of mistakes in the forum's first week. As I said on earlier thread, we can drop this whole matter if the warning is withdrawn. In return, I will apologize for starting a thread that you believe constituted a flame if HW's feeling were hurt in anyway.
Do we have a deal?
Stanley:I am not "negotiating" in this thread. I am answering questions and concerns as best I can.
Walt:
Okay. Feel free to chime into the Haterz Cast tonight if you wish.
EDIT: If you are not up to negotiating a settlement to this mess, will you please now answer my original question: what was objectionable about my original post concerning Galina doing a webcam. We may not agree on it, but its in everyone's interest to fully understand where the line between acceptable and unacceptable behavior is.
Stanley has yet to respond to that post.
Yep, they got some Freddy Kruger psychos moderating that board. Heil Hitler! Lick the fascist boot. Chop, chop, of with your head. I dissed duane (i.e. told the truth about him) one time and got shouted down. You get the same thing over here. And for god's sake, don't be banging on that lost mittens freak either. LOL.
Is it a meltdown or just a tiff between a poster and a forum administrator? Well since this issue has arised, I've gotten nearly a dozen PMs from CHC members who are very dissatisfied with the Stanley and Tracy (aka The Dude and T) and the rest of the merry band of moderators have run the new site.
Walt, what exactly is your goal here?
check your email caseysexlife
LawnmowerMan PMed me and said that he flagged my comment, not because it was over the line in itself, but that it could lead to responses that would be. I've enjoyed LMM posts over the past several months, and we'll just have to disagree here. Again, my comment was not vulgar or overly offensive. If anything, I was more insulting TO MYSELF than Galina with the crack about my weight/appearance.
This issue is more than just some stupid comment that I made, that may or may not have been in bad taste. Rather, it's whether we as The Haterz Community should restrict our discussion with the pseudo-fascist constraints on free speech. Stanley and Tracy started CHC because they claimed that Rob Dawg controlled the discussion too much. I disagree with that assessment, but I think that we need to discuss how they're much worse (IMHO) than Rob ever was.
i believe walt would like it acknowledged that he is not wrong. i dont think he is but then again he was not given respect either it came off wrong and thedude defended instead of answering
I was asked by Bob Guccione, personally, to be a center fold model and I was very insulted.
Today I wish I had done Penthouse, look at Vanessa Williams, former Pent House Model.
So your comment interpretation can go wither way.
Why does there have to be a goal LMM? What exactly is your goal in caring?
@ LMM
Walt, what exactly is your goal here?
I just want to give those who are considering "jumping ship" to CHC realize that the management over there is much more juvenile, arbitrary, and overbearing than Rob ever was. I am hoping that a candid public discussion about everyone's issues (whether with Rob, Stanley, Tracy, or whoever) will result in a forum (either here, CHC, or elsewhere) where we can converse freely so long as we are tasteful with our comments about the fucktard that is Casey K Serin.
Stanley and Tracy started CHC because they claimed that Rob Dawg controlled the discussion too much.
That's not my understanding of the genesis of CHC. But I wasn't a party to it, so it's not my place to say.
What I will say, though, is that I largely moved to CHC not because the conversation here was too controlled, but because it was not controlled *enough*. At the time, the trolls on EN were making it all but unreadable. CHC offered a troll-free environment that was very attractive.
JMHO.
Why does fucktard always make me laugh?
Here is another exchange within the same thread between Stanley and myself regarding whether or not I should cross-post to EN (I decided to do so only after he started deleting benign comments of mine).
Walt:
Stanley,
I'd like to cross-post this topic to EN, to get some outsider perspective as well. Do you have any objection to me doing so?
...
Stanley:
Yes, I would. What goes on here is our business and our business only. I could care less what "an outsider"'s point of view is.
...
Walt:
Well the purpose wouldn't have been to solicit any sort of binding input, but to get a fresh, unbiased perspective from our fellow Haterz. The manner in which this forum is (mis)managed is of general interest to the broader Caseyverse, not just simply those who have migrated over to here.
But I respect your desire on this matter and will honor your wish to keep this "in-house" so long as you do not delete any content
...
Stanley:
The manner in which this board is managed is none of their business....just as how another board is managed is none of my business
...
Walt:
Well your entire selling point for this forum is that Cote mismanaged EN. It seems only fair that potential participants of CH.C be exposed to possible mismanagement on your part as well. This thread is not for your benefit, but for the benefit of the "Haterz Community" as a whole.
But as I said, I will not cross-post. However, I'm keeping a record of this thread and will cross-post it in its entirety if you were to delete it.
...
Stanley:
Question for clarity: Are you saying you will cross post content from this board should I decide to move or delete content from my own board?
...
Walt
You're deleting content without justification and you're not answering direct questions. Obviously, this is a discussion that needs to occur on a neutral forum. I have asked Rob if he would be willing to provide a topic on EN for its discussion. In addition, I will raise these concerns during tonight's Haterzcast.
...
Stanley:
This board's business stays on this board.....period. I cannot make it any clearer. The proper manner in which to address board issues in on the board. To take our business elsewhere is not in the best interest of the board.
...
Walt:
No, not if you are going to impede an honest, neutral discussion of the issues. I invite you to call up the HaterzCast and we can talk directly about CH.C's management problems.
In any event, I'm more interested in the best interests of the Haterz Community as a whole, not this forum. As are most people, I believe.
...
Stanley:
Then, you do what you think is right and I will do the same
...
Sometime around when I posted about him deleting my content, I sent this email to Rob:
Subject: Management of CHC
Rob,
I don't know if you've been following today's
developments with regards to CH.C over there, but
there's a huge meltdown going on among several posters
(including myself) and the pseudo-fascist management
of The Dude and Tracy. Would you be willing to allow
EN to serve as a forum to have an open discussion
about these concerns? The Dude keeps deleting our
comments without cause.
I'm asking if you'd set up a special topic so that
those of us who frequent both sites to carry on an
open, honest discussion. But I wanted to get your
blessing before contaminating EN with it.
Thanks,
walt526
walt526 is pugnacious. Breeheehee, better pucker up big boy, edgar's sister is coming to town, and she's looking for some action.
Why does fucktard always make me laugh?
I don't know. Fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard
There, that should keep you in stitches for awhile. OMG, FMW, look at all the hits on your profile, over 3000, woohoo!
Fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard fucktard.
That should be good for a few more giggles..
Stanley finally posted a response to my question, with regard to whether or not my original post was over the line:
Sure...that's exactly what the Mods and I are working on right now. The problem it this. We try and keep discussions open and people are pretty much allowed to express their opinion. In order to do that, we can't have a rigid set of rules with a two foot wide line saying "here and no further". What we CAN do is have have policies and procedures in place to address what one person feels is appropriate. In the end, it comes down to a judgment call....one the other person isn't going to agree with. Such is the nature of message boards.
To try and get as SPECIFIC as I can, without going back and reading the entire thread, I suppose it would depend on where you were taking the comment. If I am going to make a call right now based on what you included, I would interpret that it to mean she could charge money for behavior via the webcam. I would have sent you a PM and say....that's a little over the line. She's not given any indication she would behave in that manner so to imply that's a way to make money, is wrong. You could agree or disagree, but in the end, my word will be the last one. I'm not pulling rank, but someone has to have the last word and make the call....goes with the territory.
I learned a long time ago I cannot make everyone happy so I don't try. I do the best I can and if anyone wants to leave and form their own board or find some place better suited to them.....Leave and go with my best wishes. However, I'm not going to have endless debate and argue over board policy or acceptable behavior. Members will respect Mods and their decisions. Mods will respect members and enforce board policy in a fair manner. I'm telling you folks.....other than a few misunderstandings or bad days....these Mods have worked their ass off for you. Over 10,000 freakin' posts and we spend an entire afternoon pissed at a handful. Let's put things into perspective....and if there's a wrong, it will be made right....by all paries. Once we finish with everything and get it posted, each and every member will have to ask themselves...do I want to stay or do I want to leave?
Unless you have another topic, this closed this one.
@CSL: Why does there have to be a goal LMM? What exactly is your goal in caring?
My goal is that EN and CHC coexist peaceably without a few individuals stirring up a phony feud between them.
It's divisive. And it feels to me a little like the division is being fed to add some extra drama to saga. Casey's actions aren't enough -- now we have to turn on each other? Please.
LMM, I really appreciate the hard work on Caseypedia, but with all due respect, I got the evidence right here in the car. Jackie Gleason aka Buford T. Justice: Put the evidence in the car...
Stanley has just deleted or closed the thread (or maybe I've been banned?) before I could respond. So here's my response:
Walt:
Again, I appreciate that you recognized that you have some issues to resolve with your moderators.
Now I take issue with you deleting earlier content. My understanding was that comments would be edited for vulgarity. Why did YOU delete my content on this thread earlier?
Again, the issue that we have here is not about whether or not my comment was over-the-line or not. It's whether or not the moderators are able/willing to provide a forum for free and open discussion. Banning posters (or threatening to do so) or deleting comment should only be done if the content is obscene or personally insulting. Not if the moderator/administrator just happens to disagree with the substance of the post.
Yeah, apparently I've been banned from CHC. People can decide for themselves whether or not that action was appropriate. I would suggest that people remain at EN if they want a free, unfiltered conversation.
Hmmmm, over 10,000 posts and 10% of them are Tracy's. Yeah, she is really working her ass off for "you". Someone has a major ego issue when it comes to reading their own comments....
"Members will respect Mods and their decisions. Mods will respect members and enforce board policy in a fair manner."
How was I respected, Stanley??? No advance warning from YOUR moderators and then no explanation as to why afterwards. In fact, if I had not emailed you during the night I still would have no clue why I couldn't log in. Your response that I should email Tracy to try and work is out was not even worth responding to. But I most politely did, told you that Tracy was not worth the time and wished you well, correct?
here is a picture of Duane Legate:
Read the bottom of the web page!
http://www.sibleyforest.org/gallery.asp?PhotoLib=2006OpenPoker&Photo=6&menu=
@ Casey's Sex Life
What makes you so certain it was my exclusive decision to have you banned? Surely you realize that by banning people, I will put a muzzle also on myself, right? And no one likes to talk shit more than me. So maybe you should get all the facts straight before you jump to conclusions.
Anything I had to say to you I did via PM. I'm a direct person' surely you know this?
If you or anyone else would like to talk to me, ream me a new one, or whatever... feel free to email me @ nachocat@msn.com
Rob Dawg;
Y'know, I wouldn't devote any posts at all to the brou-ha-has that may or may not be occurring over at CHC.
Fact of the matter is that many people drummed their heels and stuffed maxi-pads into their hemmorhaging orifices with both hands about how you ran things here, and left in a huff to go pitch camp there.
Now they're there...let them and their basket of woes STAY there.
The target is Casey...not petit primadonnas who want to be the bride at every wedding and the corpse at every funeral.
n wonder duane is so hostile and defensive about his guuuuhleeeena is that the only woman alive who gives him any attention?!!!!
ofcourse i would swat his pussy pathetic smarmy lame nerd boy ass too unless he mentioned money!!!!!!!! hahahahhahaha
Tracy:
Why was I banned? You said earlier tonight that no one would be banned for simply asking questions.
Rob Dawg,
I suggest you get over yourself.
CSL, we're discussing CHC now on the Haterz Cast.
Stanley (aka The Dude)
I suggest you get over yourself.
Fixed that.
Tracy,
Of course it was your exclusive decision. And how was I supposed to get your PM when I was kicked off with no notice. For the record, I NEVER received a PM, nor an email from you regarding anything.
You did this to yourself Tracy - and there are a LOT of people out there that have no respect for you because of your actions. Let me remind you of some of your insufferable remarks:
"Tracy, as I said in my PM response, thank you for your feedback. But I'd like to talk about this issue directly with The Dude."
Just so you know, The Dude will back what the mods and I do and say. We are a team. So your attempt to go "straight to the top" will probably be a waste of time. If you think you can divide and conquer... you are mistaken.
But by all means, have a go at it."
Nice one Tracy, how about this one:
"This is not your decision to make. We hand-selected the mods and we're quite happy with our choices.
I would like to respectfully add that if you are unhappy with the management, you are more than welcome to leave and not come back."
And the biggest gem of all which contradicts your stating that no one should be insulted and makes me wonder why you are downright lying about ever sending me a PM. Are you already falling down on the job - only three, oops sory Walt, four people banned and you have already forgotten to warn on of them in advance:
"To the moderators:
How many people altogether have been banned? What led to their being asked to leave?"
Not that it's anyone's business other than The Dude's and we mods, however, three people have been banned.
1 - slimunit
2 - just silly me
3 - casey's sex life
There has been no ban on Pink Lips. Maybe she should try to register before she takes her medication with a whiskey chaser and she's be able to do it properly?
The mods and admin make collective decisions regarding banning. I prefer not to ban anyone, however, when we continue to get numerous complaints from long-time members, we must make a collective decision.
We don't make those decisions lightly and they are only made after several attempts via PM are made to work it out amicably.
I am usually the one PMing to try to work it out and, other than The Dude, I am the only other person able to actually ban which is why they're attacking me about it. Oh, well.
Luckily, I don't base my self-esteem on what others think of me, so if they want to blame me, fine... have at it."
Still waiting on my PM, Tracy.....
@ Mort,
Yep a few more giggles.
And this "Put the evidence in the car."
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
3000 times!
@ Sharkey,
Yep, it has been quiet here, not is a bad way.
ATTENTION PEOPLE!! Will someone please take a look at the picture OCP provided and identify which one is duane? Come on now, you know we're gonna find out anyway.
@ LMM
My goal is that EN and CHC coexist peaceably without a few individuals stirring up a phony feud between them.
Before this evening, that was my goal as well. Unfortunately I underestimated how juvenile and petty Stanley and Tracy are. But clearly they are not up for the challenges of running a successful forum.
I would encourage all my fellow Haterz to abandon CHC. What I wrote is up here for anyone to see--was anything so vulgar or insulting to warrant a ban? I don't think so. Rob may not be perfect, but he is a much worthier custodian of the Haterz forums.
BTW Tracy, the Dude already told me last night that he had no clue about me being banned. So if you and he are the only ones with the "exclusive right" to ban anyone how was this NOT an exclusive decision by you and you only??
The Dude asked me to email you to see if I could work it out so that I could be "allowed" back into CHC. I politely told him thanks, but no thanks - I felt no need to try and ask for ANYTHIING from you.
By you acting like a bigshot yesterday and banning me, you are now paying the dear price of fame. People DO NOT like you.
I wasn't impressed with CHC and still prefer EN. I'm surprised people are complaining about too much moderation because I thought there was none! There seemed to be multiple threads for each topic, and most of the comments seemed to be bitching about how much everyone hated EN, or how much they hate other haterz. Even if that stuff was funny in the beginning, it gets old fast.
CHC seems to be nothing more than one big high school game, with everyone joining a clique and turning on each other.
Let's go start some new blogs!
"Haterz of Casey Haterz"
"Casey Haterz who Hate OTHER Casey Haterz"
"Haterz of Casey Supporterz who strongly dislike SOME Casey Haterz, and tolerate others"
"Haterz.com...Whatever the Fuck it is, we Fuckin' HATEZ it!"
"Kinder and Gentler Casey Hatezin' Blog"
"Why Won't You Talk To Me? Blog"
"I Hatez all you assholes and I don't even know who Casey Fuckin' Serin IS"
I reckon they can pop up like toadstools in a cow-pasture after a thunderstorm
@ Mort,
I do not know who Duane is but the blond guy is kinda cute. Is that you?
I have to go, loozer(TM) W2 tomorrow and EST.
TTFN
IW
@ ALL,
See ya this weekend at the EN Meet UP in Orlando.
@ CLC
Tracy was entertaining at times when she was obsessed with Turdflake, but she is clearly not an emotionally stable person. I was hoping to have an adult, candid discussion with Stanley, who I had hoped would be reasonable. But oh well. Like Tracy said, he's her bitch.
But people, seriously let's keep the conversation at EN, where we can trust Rob to provide a free forum for discussing the trainwreck that is our favorite little fliptard.
I must confess;
I REALLY miss Toby. We used to have the bestest discussions.
And there's something about the stench of a cyber field-hand, trudging home at the end of the day...
@ Overopinionated
CHC seems to be nothing more than one big high school game, with everyone joining a clique and turning on each other.
That's a pretty good way of putting it. A less polite way would be to say that it's a clusterfuck or circle jerk among a few petty "loosers" who have nothing else worthwhile in this world.
There (CHC)seemed to be multiple threads for each topic, and most of the comments seemed to be bitching about how much everyone hated EN, or how much they hate other haterz. Even if that stuff was funny in the beginning, it gets old fast.
Indeed. Half of Tracy's posts involve a little head of Rob from that dreadful picture of him saying something insulting.
Who said there isn't a rivalry?
Rob Dawg bounces back after a day of Cab and Tri-tips with an insider guest post and dual-post real-time comment threads for the haterzcast.
Nice to see you got your game back Dawg.
equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper equity stripper
na na na naaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Hell, half the posts at CHC are Tracys or Dudes...........
Hell, half the posts at CHC are Tracys or Dudes.........
Well let's be fair: the first few days of CHC were impressive in terms of response from Haterz. Unfortunately, this came at the expense of EN, which I'm guilty as anyone in terms of attention. CHC is the hot new thing and as a forum it is somewhat easier to follow than EN (although EN's gotten a lot better since registration was required). But if Stanley and Tracy continue pissing off longtime Haterz, there going to find their site vacant rather quick.
Whatever,
Before I bother to reply, let me ask you a question:
Are you a Haterz or a Supporterz?
Yes, it does matter.
El Gabo
Very true Walt.
One question - now that Duane is NOT buying the blog will this be the last we hear from him??? Please? Why do these two men waste so much time on Casey? Now they are discussing Galina's motives and decisions. This is beyond bizarre.
Just sent this email to Stanley:
Stanley,
Just curious why I was banned at CHC. None of my comments were vulgar, disrespectful, or offensive.
I don't really care, just curious about your reasoning.
-Walt
I'll post any response at EN.
...
@ CSL
One question - now that Duane is NOT buying the blog will this be the last we hear from him??? Please? Why do these two men waste so much time on Casey? Now they are discussing Galina's motives and decisions. This is beyond bizarre.
I don't know why those two are still wasting time and company's reputations with Casey.
But honestly, I don't know why *I* am still interested in this thing. This thing has really run its course and it's probably time to move on. For ALL of us, myself included.
no i love it that duane cant shut his smarmy mouth!!!!!
tony of evidence cached when someone searches his name now i bet he worked hard getting ll those interviews up tom but now its all case all duane
will someday be a very big embarrassment for him being involved in this and it just thrills the hell out of me
This is my last evening with this drivel. Duane and Mark have totally trashed their reputations - people on IAFF are more for Casey because they can't stand these guys.
THEN GO AWAY DUANE!!!!
100th
The other day Duane said he bought houses.net for 75k.
Why are there several links on his placeholder page like "sexy russian women"?
Is Mark V. the same Mark V. that posted on creditwrench.com?
I think so...
Alexa traffic comparison of EN, CHC and IAFF websites. Rising traffic across all three, although it looks like CHC cut into somme of IAFF's traffic for a day or two.
EN, CHC & IAFF
Yes.
I am out of my flipping mind but I'm also a neutral observer!
Until we hear from Galina herself, I don't believe we're getting the truth from Duane in regard to her feelings, wants and needs.
Where's the damn lime Jello strategy?
And some decent key lime pie!
Indeed its time to move on from this bizarre saga. Before I go I want to apologize to Rob, Mark and Duane for some of my offending posts. I don't know you guys but in the end you seem like stand up individuals. I believe that Duane is communicating with Galina and that she has no intention of getting back together with KC if he pays her bills or not. Good for you Galina. KC is totally screwed and he's gonna loose his blog. Duane and Mark are going to sell it and give Galina the proceeds, good for you guys. Rob sorry for some of the comments towards you I was just fueling the fire but I realize now that Casey IS just a con artist and these guys are going after him because no one else would. In the end he's finished. His tax bill alone is going to kill him.. IRS debt can't be forgiven in bankruptcy so its game over got KC. Anyhow its been fun but its not fun anymore. I hope you post up a link to donate to Galina I'd donate.
-Aaron
yeah rob can put up a link for galina just like he put up a link for forums.
What I really HATE is
1. Dick Cheney
2. Karl Rove
3. George W. Bush
However, I did enjoy the absurdly funny interlude hating KC...while it lasted.
@ Miguel
Respectfully, if you don't think that there's a major problem brewing at CHC, then you're simply not paying attention. When I was debating back and forth this evening with Tracy and Stanley, there was a flood of PMs supporting me for having the stones to stand up to those two fucktwits. Maybe they banned me because they were afraid that I was going to start cross-posting those on EN as well?
I don't know, and I don't really care. I will say that those two are toxic and given enough time, eventually the Haterz masses will leave CHC for greener pastures, either by returning to EN or going to a new forum. Although with the Turdflake story winding down, it's possible that everyone will move on before that happens.
But I'd seriously reconsider whether or not you want to willingly associate with those two. They are nearly as toxic as Casey.
BTW, no response yet from Stanley tonight from my email asking for an explanation regarding my ban from CHC. If he could defend it, he would. But I think that he knows that he can't answer the inquiry without further revealing what a little fucktwit he and Tracy are.
LOL... gotta love internet spats.
I take that back. Stanley just emailed me back:
Stanley:
If you don't care, my reasoning won't matter.....LOL
Good luck and Best Wishe
...
Walt:
Stanley,
I'm only asking because I've gotten a few inquiries on EN and via email about it and want to know if there's an actual reason. So what was the last straw? Inquiring minds want to know.
-Walt
So let's see what he comes back with. Until proven otherwise, he and Tracy are both fucktwits and bullies as far as I'm concerned.
Sounds like people are getting too worked up about message board drama...
Seriously, this Casey stuff is supposed to be all shits and giggles (for us outsiders, at least). If it's getting you upset you should probably take a step back and disconnect for a while.
True enough, Tesla. But no one likes being bullied by some cowardly punk, which is the frustration that's coming across here.
CSL
Check your email. Hi Walt and everyone else that stuck around here after Duane came on board.
Heidi
Thanks Heidi - I really appreciate it.
Wow, what happened overnight at CH.C? Bummer on the bannings-- I thought Casey's Sex Life's postings there were amusing. I've been trying to get caught up on everything that happened in the last 15 hours, and good lord!
Interesting post by LMP-- should be some fireworks soon... I've been amazed that Casey could think to welsh so thoroughly on a settlement! What a looser...
Can someone kindly give me the website to CH. C?
I don't believe I have ever been there before.
April
CHC=caseyhaterz.com
Some people like their format better than EN's. I was never there long enough to really get a feel for it, but it does offer some advantages over Blogger.
Unfortunately, it also means interacting with the two little children over there who run it. I disagree with Rob on pretty much everything politically, but the man does have intellectual integrity. That's a lot more than you can say about Stanley (aka The Dude).
Walt
I didn't read the entire exchange but I think your suggestion for Galina was WAY over the line.
Happy?
Its one things to talk crap about people who will defend themselves.
But suggesting things like "she should be a stripper" to someone who never posts and would rather not even be part of the story is WAY over the line.
Those threads on CHC are just inappropriate, my only beef with the rules there is not being able to rip into the people who start them.
Yes I really wish people would lay off Duane and LMP, but agendas are what they will be. And those guys did involve (and continue to) in this saga.
The comment in itself is immaterial. The issue that I (and apparently several others) have is the manner in which "the standards" are established and enforced. That was the principle that I was defending, not my right to make some asinine comment about Galina.
People who focus on that one, throw-away line are missing the big picture, IMHO.
Post a Comment