HOUSE # 1:  A 20-room mansion (not including 8 bathrooms) heated by natural gas. There is a pool (and a pool house) and a separate guest house all heated by gas. In ONE MONTH ALONE this mansion consumes more energy than the average American household in an ENTIRE YEAR. The average bill for electricity and natural gas runs over $2,400.00 per month. In natural gas alone (which last time we checked was a fossil fuel), this property consumes more than  HOUSE # 2:Designed by an architecture professor at a leading national university, this house incorporates every "green" feature current home construction can provide. The house contains only heats the house in winter and cools it in summer. The system uses no fossil fuels such as oil or natural gas, and it consumes 25% of the electricity required for a conventional heating/cooling system. Rainwater from the roof is collected and funneled into a 25,000 gallon underground cistern. Wastewater from showers, sinks and toilets goes into underground purifying tanks and then into the cistern. The collected water then irrigates the land surrounding the house. Flowers and shrubs native to the area blend the property into the surrounding rural landscape. HOUSE # 1 Nashville, Tennessee. Abode of that renowned environmentalist (and filmmaker) Al Gore. HOUSE # 2 Crawford, Texas. Also known as "the Texas White House," it is the private residence of the President of the United States, George W. Bush. |
Is it getting warm in here?
70 comments:
firstiness!
effing hilarious post Dawg.
Please don't try to inject politics into the global warming discussion.
Its a way of deflecting the conversation that is unhelpful to finding economically viable solutions.
Adam - that's not politics, that is comedy.
I knew there was a reason I liked bush....
Er... I mean Bush....
I thought I was taking politics out of the equation by establishing "enumerable criteria" by which to make rational decisions. Really longtime readers know that when I break out "enumerable" things are likely to get heated. The reasoning is the same for global warming or transit or affordable housing. I insist on science; that means measuarble and repeatable results. People don't like it but all three are not science nor should they be public policy because they fail those tests repeatedly.
Understand, I am everything that pro-urbanitsts hate yet I do near everything they profess to support in the abstract. It isn't just our leaders.
If its just comedy, my bad. I just hate to see such an important issue politicized.
Oh, and Gore's natgas average bill for one month would pay mine for 2 years. 'Scourse I've got two teenage girls so in a few years we are talking 50-60x rather than the current 24x.
I have no problem with requiring data. The vast majority of serious peer reviewed scientists support the theory of global warming.
Equating a scientific theory (which can be overwhelmingly supported but never truly proven) with economic policies does not work.
FWIW, I wholeheartedly agree with you on affordable housing and do not profess to know enough about urban planning to agree or disagree.
Adam,
Exactly the right attitude. That you understand my problem with affordable housing would. I hope, give me a little leeway to talk about the others before being dismissed as a fruitcake. Global warming is a FAct. Most places have gotten warmer in tha last 200 years. A few more ºC and we'll even be getting back to the pre-Dark Ages comfort levels of legend when residents of England didn't need fireplaces. No, the question is one of anthropogenics not thermometer. 'Scourse I could mention that there hasn't been any "global warming" since 1998 but that would be dismissed the next time there is an extra hurricane or whatever so I won't talk about the weather and try to pass it off as climate evidence. Were that everyone did thet.
this post is far more specific. It doesn't matter if we are running out of oil or entering a new heat period. Heat pumps/sinks and passive solar and all that make sense on their own.
Personally, I think Dubya and Gore are both pretty douchey. Did you really expect integrity from a guy who claimed he created the internet? I haven't fogotten about his wife running the PMRC either.
That being said, I would gladly give Casey and Nigel's right testicles to be able to go back and exchange the last eight years of Bush for eight years of Gore. I'll take pointless posturing over war mongering any day.
And to be fair, to make a valid comparison, you really need to throw Cheney into the mix. I'm pretty sure that his 10000 sq.ft. bunker/crypt is heated by a furnace that burns asbestos, puppies, and nuclear waste.
Ming, that's all natural heating from the depths of hell! Completely eco-friendly!
Rob - time to start pushing buttons again on DHC
I admire Gore's success at starting debate. But it'll be fine with me the day he's not needed. I also insist that America would be radically better off today with President Gore. Don't even fuck with me.
My house is tiny but I kinda waste water on an outdoor tub. I have a plan to recycle that water. I mostly bike and coaster scooter to get around. Republicans of yore knew the value of thrift. Environmentalism is not partisan. Neither is hypocracy. I bet he buys carbon credits, and perhaps he should.
Even the tightest McMansion, made with all the 'greenest' products still has a bigger carbon footprint than a small, uninsulated house.
@ gameover
Ha! I hadn't thought of that! The Cheney solution to the energy crunch: brimstone powered vehicles. Or alternately, they could be powered with pellets made from the extracted life essence of hippies and liberals.
Bush / Cheney - 4(000) more years!
Rob,
I don't think you're a fruitcake, sorry if my first post came across that way.
I'm also not an expert on climate change but after analyzing as much science as my non-expert brain can absorb it certainly looks like the smart money is on CO2 causing drastic changes to the Earth's climate if something isn't done.
And I totally agree that ascribing every strange weather pattern that occurs anywhere to global warming is ridiculous. Hell, as you say some places will be better off and have nicer weather. But a lot of coastal areas could be devastated by rising ocean levels displacing millions of people and causing an economic disaster unknown to modern times.
IMO, just a chance that a disaster like that could come to pass is enough to invest in technology to make sure it doesn't happen. Its not going to happen through government or business efforts alone, both will have to work together.
Not making excuses as I think it's silly that Gore preaches one thing and lives the opposite.
But to give Gore 1 pt. - he can explain why his house uses so much gas and the effects it has.
Bush - something tells me he couldn't tell you what his house does to benefit the environment other than "ahh, its all good for the environment"
Rob, how much does it cost to incorporate these green features? Trying to calculate an ROI on these features.
Just posted as "casey serin" at DHC, we'll see if it makes it through:
Nigel, if you think you get it bad, you should see what they're doing to me! I could post that I just secured full-time employment, and the Haterz™ would say, "Why don't you have 3 jobs??"
I could post that I've gotten 3 jobs, and they'd say, "Why not 5...?!?!"
If I spell things wrong, I'm criticized and laughed at (c.f. "looser", "ceased"). But if I somehow make it through a post without any spelling errors, they'll claim that a ghost-writer is posting in my place!! I "loose" every time!
You've got it easy compared to ol' SerCasey, my friend ;-)
Putting up a comparison of Gore vs Bush injects politics where it's not necessary.
The Internet is stuffed to the gills with left-versus-right political yammering already, I for one would really like it if EN were a partisan-free zone.
Well written Benoit. It sounds very believable. Probably won't go through though because Nigey reads EN compulsively.
when I was in the US a few months ago there was a reality show on one of the lesser networks. "Life with Ed." The focus was on Ed Begley Jrs green lifstyle. Amusing in a sort of Green Acres but very educational. I'm not ready to ride a bicycle for 30 minutes to generate power for the toaster but he has some interesting ideas.
@Rob - I think your comparison is very funny.
Partisan free zone????? Why?
We screw over everybody, everything, every time.....why should politics get a sweet ride?
I'm hoping for a GameOver Free Zone so I can get back to my exaulted throne of Firstness. In the end, being first is all that counts....the balance of the discussion is for loosers.
ratlab said...
Rob, how much does it cost to incorporate these green features? Trying to calculate an ROI on these features.
This is where all my haterz™ have to pick their jaws up off the floor. You see, the common perception is that I must be a Birch Society reject for my overly extremist conservative views. The real green features actually cost less than what we do now. "But, but, Rob Dawg, that doesn't seem right. How?" Sustainable Architecture advocacy has been stolen by those who wish to control future urban development patterns. Artitects and urban planners don't make money or get to control society if they confess that 2x6 construction with low density and auto orientation not only uses fewer resources but generates more municipal income relative to costs. You see there is no need for so many planners if the answer is more Levittowns and fewer Celebrations.
You want passive? No. Not allowed. Passive shading requires lower densities for trees and fewer DU/acre beacuse roof overhangs don't work in zero lot line developments.
Rob Dawg said...
Am I allowed to reply to the accusations made and questions asked? Will they be moderated?
Salt Lake Mortgage Guy said...
Sure you can...at your place. Your tantrum with the multiple posting has earned you a ban.
You can come back when you learn to play nice.
___________________________________
BWAHAHAHAHA!
Nigel is a douchebag of the first degree.
its on now Stan!
The thing that annoys me about all of the global warming hype is that it's always portrayed as a drastic change. It's not, it's a gradual change that over a long period of time will have severe consequences. Every time anything adverse happens the gloom'n'doomers start with the "OMG, global warming!" Of course, the opponents do the same anytime weather is colder than the average.
We're talking about changes that are so gradual that we have a hard time distinguishing them from a human timeframe. The changes we make (or don't make) will impact our grandchildren more than us. We should learn to live cleaner and more efficiently, but not just because of the global-warming boogeyman. If you want to have a more immediate impact on the environment, find your nearest SUV driver and kick them in the balls.
None of us can really point fingers anyway. Nigel is the most green-friendly person involved in this whole thing for chosen deity's sake. His home is entirely heated by the hot air coming out of his own mouth.
BA DUM DUM! wakawakawaka
What, no mention of carbon credits?
On a completely unrelated note, in reading Middles Ages history I remember reading about indulgences, and thinking to myself, who would ever fall for such a scheme?
FYI, Mrs. GameOver submitted a comment on IAFF.com today and her ASW was pregnancy.
Dammit Steph where are your boots!
its on now Stan!
Oh, it's *on*.
But no. That's exactly what Nigel wants: a nice juicy shitstorm to drive up his traffic. He has no more juice to offer on Casey; so now he's baiting the haters.
Hold firm. Do not fall for it. Do not comment there. Do not give him the traffic he craves.
Indulgences boy did you ever open a can o'worms with this Catholic boy. Remember, Middle Ages, no Christians, just Catholics.
Who would ever fall for such a "scheme?" Try the House #1 owner. He is buying credits. He is buying them from a company he owns! He makes more than he pays. This is EXACTLY like indulgences. THe rich got richer the merchantiles (middle class) were presented with a higher barrier to comfort and the poor were clearly excluded.
The more things change the more...
Or is it;
Those who refuse to learn from history...
reading about indulgences, and thinking to myself, who would ever fall for such a scheme?
Casey's great^15-grandfather, circa 1520 A.D.:
"So you're saying that if I pay a couple thousand rubles to my church, I'm absolved of any and all sins for all eternity? SWEET DEAL!!!"
"But no. That's exactly what Nigel wants: a nice juicy shitstorm to drive up his traffic. He has no more juice to offer on Casey; so now he's baiting the haters."
The funny thing is that he won't keep the traffic! We'll all just comment here @ home base and ignore his bass-ackward site.
Did I stumble into the Rush Limbaugh forums? Come on.
I was so not getting into this incredibly biased, fact-sidestepping nonsense but... sigh.
First, Gore has two offices in that house, second, yeah, the credits that they pay for reduce their carbon footprint to zero.
Second, the architect who designed the Crawford house has his own views, quite reflected in its design.
Third, great, Bush has an environemtnally friendly house, yet he wants to open ANWR, he won't sign Kyoto, he's the best friend big oil ever had, he's fought to reverse protections on land all over the U.S., etc., etc. Come ON.
Rob:
I agree somewhat and disagree somewhat. Traditional forms of architecture and landscaping are, in fact, much more efficient. I know people who live in many places in the Mountain West, comfortably, without air conditioning, using natural plant shade and traditional home architecture (e.g. low profile home, brick or even adobe walls, etc.) You necessarily need a certain amount of low density for that to work.
The problem is that doesn't mesh well with the modern way of life. Exurbanites aren't content with small town amenities, and demand suburban facilities like big-box retailers, megaplexes, etc. But those retailers need a certain volume to be profitable, so they draw traffic from a wide distance. Where once people drove a mile to the grocery store, they now routinely drive ten, fifteen miles to the big box retailer. All that energy that was once being saved is being burned up in transportation, construction, and of course energy needs for gigantic, inefficient retail space.
Add to that the job needs. Telecommuting is well and good, but in reality most people go into the office, which again, necessarily, draws people from a wide range. Add to that the very high level of air travel common in today's business, and any energy benefits from low-density housing are being blasted away in massive amounts of transportation and infrastructure.
The old small town tradition of development was much more energy efficient, but it's gone. What we have now is urbanites trying to live their same lifestyle in communities that weren't designed for it, and high gas prices, massive traffic congestion, and reckless development is the result.
Global Warming is associated with climate shifts, occuring naturally. Humans have little impact on increasing temps....
The Chicken Little Chorus is just another verse in the PC correctness song.
Good Lord, it's hot outside.
Nigel BANNED Dawg!
Methinks it's bitchslap time for Cornflake.
Sic'em Dawg!
Game,
Did you see the video on Cornflake's site about the "First" guy? He's.....like a God!....and what I aspire to be when I grow up.
Mud huts are the way to go, ya'll. Check out this sweet black-plague-foreclosure I picked up for a song.
My parents built a 2500-sq. ft. house (with partially heated basement of about the same size) with 2 x 6 construction, and their winter heating bills are about the same as those in the same city who have a 1400 -sq. ft. 2 x 4 house.
My Nigel rebuttal is in the book cover thread (Self Diagnosis at 1:57 PM, Anonymous said...)
...enjoy!
From Nigeypoo:
"Since the ENers attack and berate anyone that doesn't agree with them, the group think there has turned into a freaky, Lord of the Flies, incestuous orgy type of thought. Here's a dose of reality for your folks. Nobody cares!"
I for one take great pride in the freaky, Lord of the Flies, incestuous orgy type of thought that we've nurtured here. It's why I like this site.
NOW SMASH PIGGY'S FACE!! RAAAAAAAAAAAAHR!!
Also, if there's one thing that Nigel knows about, it's about nobody caring.
@ming
Does "incestuous orgy" = "what Nigel really wants but can't have because he's a 'blog traffic repellant'"?
Thanks, beezer, I didn't have the energy.
Can we keep EN politics free, pullleeeezzee?
LOL, I take NO offense at Nigel's stereotyping of every poster here. He has no objectivity to see that every poster here is their own person with their own thoughts. To imply we're a mob that can't think is ludicrous.
Yep Nigey, I spell quite well and you aren't a beacon of perfection yourself. I could blow you away in a spelling match but the problem with you is you'd find a way to say you won. You suck.
Only a self absorbed idiot would believe what you do about this group of posters. What's the matter, jealous that we can think for ourselves and that we don't recite book reports that have nothing original in them? You sir, are the idiot.
BTW, what is your fascination with Rob? Is it because he schools you at every turn? Does it hurt your weak ego?
I believe I have the answer...he's jealous. HE'S the real hater here. He hates on Rob because he cannot fathom why Rob's site gets 50 times the hits any of Nigel's craptastic blogs do. Is it possible that he can't dig up anymore dirt on the "haterz?"
Talk amongst yourself. Nigel is a dirtbag.
If Nigel is typing his blog and no one visits to read it...does it make a sound?
bob dawg,
attacking the messenger is bad form in a debate and I thought you were above that.
sigh. I've given up with global warming -- and any other complex issue that can't be solved with a simple sound-bite answer. Issues like trade, health care, fiscal and foreign policy.
The "correct" answers are nuianced and require essay-style answers.
People like Gore who can do that are maligned, while people who lack the intellectual curiousity to examine issues in depth are celebrated, like Bush. I don't think Bush is dumb per se, just intellectually uncurious; to him everything is "black" or "white" and for many issues that is not the case.
sigh. go on. poke your fun. From Jerimiah forward, those who preached "mend your ways or else" have been maligned. The treatment Gore gets is no different.
Just remember that soon after Jerimiah preached, Jerusalem (the Israelite capital) was sacked. Soon after Gore preaches, our enivironment will be "sacked" as well.
The majority of people in this country are functionally retarded, and
attacking the messenger is bad form in a debate and I thought you were above that.
I'm not very far above single celled organisims on the evolutionary scale but I like to think holding up a light is not the same as putting a torch to their butt. There is a little of my non-partisan disgust with the partisan media as well. RWR chopped wood at his working ranch, WJC jogged to McDonald's. One was too old to govern, the other portrayed as the vigor of youth. The same thing happened with the higher achieving student Bush being the dummy compared to the lower achieving Gore alternative.
don't get me wrong, 8 years of Bush has done less to advance my views than the 8 years of Clinton. In hindsight it is hard to believe 4 or more years of Gore would be likely to do worse.
sigh. I've given up with global warming -- and any other complex issue that can't be solved with a simple sound-bite answer. Issues like trade, health care, fiscal and foreign policy.
Yup. I sympathize. Global warming is about social justice now. We just cannot call it social justice or world government because then it wouldn't be allowed to proceed.
I think Dubya is a retard and the worst thing to happen to this country in my lifetime. And I'm definitely more liberal than conservative (no bleeding heart though), but I can respect others who think differently. I don't mind a little political discussion as long as people don't take it too seriously. (Of course, I realize that's pretty much impossible.) We are all fellow haters united in our belief that Casey is a frigging idiot.
Ha, I just noticed that Nigel counted 11 evil haterz at the carnival of self-flagellation. That means he counted Team Member as a Nigel-supporter. That was me. I was playing faux-Nigel-fannnnn.
@ TV Rots Your Brain
I think Nigeypoo probably got his little orgy when he met up with Casey and Byron Goatse in SLC.
@ King Friday
Don't leave your post off like that, it sounds like it was about to get really good!
@ming
I think that Nigel is really upset because 1) mortgage brokering isn't as lucrative as it used to be and 2) he can't figure out how to get blog traffic (and thus money for it) even though he apparently posts like crazy all over the web. He sure isn't going to find the answer to his traffic improvement problems here though (nor do I think anyone here looking for a mortgage is all that inclined to seek his services).
As for the "incestuous orgy of comments" well that's what lots of blog posters do -- post on each others blogs. As for "incestuous orgies", like Nigel's blog postings I don't really care what he does or doesn't do in that department...in fact I'd rather not hear about any of that thanks.
I am also confident that what grates Nigel's cheese more than anyting is looking at the EN traffic and knowing that not only is it not monetized for exploitation but that he can't ever come close.
nigel swaby, where have you been all my life? the pushy kid who nobody wants to play with. so he worms into every conversation, only to find it strangely trailing off...
@rob dawg
It is actually nice to come and read a blog that isn't plastered over with ads, etc. Too many bloggers are of the Snowflake get rich quick mindset about blogging.
I ignore Nigel. He's too pathetic to be worth my time.
At least Casey is amusing. Nigel's just boring.
As we are almost at the end of the era of the linear blog; I'm not in this for any money. Small tips that cover operating costs are good enough. There are several extremely generous people who are best thought of as the founding patrons and they deserve far more honor than they are willing to accept. So far except for purchase of webspace and hosting and software the only other money allocated is to take Mrs. Dawg to dinner as an apology. The rest is to the betterment of the haterz™ manifesto.
Chipotle Time!
I'm quite tired of searching several posts - some RE, some KC - to guess where to post KC comments.
Can I assume that the forum is not going to happen, for whatever reason?
No! Forums are 2 1/2 weeks behind schedule because I have had other priorities. There will be forums some time between Late Friday and early Sunday -unless- real life interferes. You want quick and impulsive? There's always IAFF.
@Rob You want quick and impulsive?
Your snide comment makes no sense - you yourself have said 2 or 3 times over the last 3 or 4 weeks that forums are a couple of days away.
Please "do what you say" or "say what you mean". Either is fine...
yeah rob dawg! FLIM FLAM MAN!
I'm with Endgame: fewer promises of forums any day now. "Good things are coming" is Casey's turf.
Oh, and on the responsiveness line: this from AdBrite's directory page for IAFF makes me smirk:
This publisher generally approves new ads or edits in 2 hours
Heh. Nothing on IAFF happens within 2 hours; at least unless Casey's been on the wheatgrass.
Stan - That video is the only thing DHC has been good for since its beginning. I gotta get one of those coats!
Rob Dawg,
Your forum delays and excuses are a tad bit Casey-esqe.
"Global warming" is horseshit.
OK Rob Dawg, I agree w/your take on global warming, et. al, but I have a wee nitpicky thing w/one of your subsequent comments:
*enters history buff mode*
"Indulgences boy did you ever open a can o'worms with this Catholic boy. Remember, Middle Ages, no Christians, just Catholics."
Er, in Western Europe, that's correct. In Russia/some of what would much later become the Eastern Bloc, Eastern Orthodoxy was the state religion. In some of the Middle Eastern countries like Egypt, the Coptic church was the local Christian denomination, etc. Sorry, just had to point it out.
/end nerdiness
OK, let's not get rid of oil because of global warming, or oil profits funding terrorist, or oil wars. Get rid of oil because it is a dangerous explosive toxin that pollutes air water etc. We switched from coal -- oil is next.
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